WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:05.540 literally 00:00:05.540 --> 00:00:15.300 literally it is Tuesday August 30th 2016 this is Room in the Trees a podcast about 00:00:15.300 --> 00:00:25.220 Following the journey. The journey. The creative life. We're all on it. We're doing it. We're figuring it out. How the pieces fit together. Let's talk about it. This is it. Today. Woo! 00:00:25.880 --> 00:00:26.600 Let's go. 00:00:27.480 --> 00:00:33.720 The following was recorded on Thursday, August 25th, 2016. This is episode 18. 00:00:34.320 --> 00:00:36.480 Yeah. Breathe. 00:00:37.520 --> 00:01:09.680 Rove and Trees is hosted by Sabrina Harrison and me, Trent Reynolds. show notes including pictures, links, video, and more forever. Every episode can be found at RoomInTheTrees.com. If you are enjoying this podcast, please take a moment to rate us on iTunes, which you can get to by going to RoomInTheTrees.com/iTunes. And if you want to show monetary support, you can subscribe and become our patron at patreon.com backslash room. 00:01:10.180 --> 00:01:17.260 And now a conversation with Bayou O'Donnell, a talented actor and a great old friend of mine from years in New York City. 00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:20.020 Hi, Trent. How are you? 00:01:20.320 --> 00:01:22.260 I'm doing well, thanks. How are you doing? 00:01:22.480 --> 00:01:24.880 Doing all right. You guys are both in Santa Monica. 00:01:25.360 --> 00:01:29.140 I know. This is crazy. I could just come over to your house and we could both be in our underwear. 00:01:29.600 --> 00:01:34.840 Yes, indeed. Well, who's to say we aren't both in our underwear? 00:01:34.840 --> 00:01:42.760 Who's to say I'm wearing underwear? But that's a topic for a different time. 00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:47.600 That reminds me of when I first met you, Bayou. Yeah, exactly. 00:01:47.600 --> 00:01:50.500 Speaking of. That sounds like a story that needs to be told. 00:01:50.580 --> 00:04:45.460 I think it's pretty much one of the best stories. Should I just start with that? Go for it. Okay, so I was living in California. It's interesting. It ties into our conversation on Tuesday. I decided I wanted to move to New York City. It was 2008. and I looked on Craigslist, and within two weeks I had rented this sort of old sound stage, like this apartment, part of an apartment that I would share with four guys, but I would have across the deck, you'd cross over it, and there was a 700 square foot kind of enclosed separate space, but to use the bathroom, or to use like the shower, the bath, and the kitchen, you had to cross the deck and go into the other part of the apartment. So Bayou was the person on Craigslist that I was in touch with about this place, and I was basically renting it through him. He was not, he didn't own the place building, but he was like kind of handled getting all the housemates and you know, getting the rent paid. and so I was feeling all I was 24 and I just thought I am totally moving to New York I've got it all figured out so I decided I'm going to take a one-way jet blue overnight red-eye flight and at that point I had just gotten my deal with uh Villard with Random House and I was I had, I was like, I'm going to have them pick me up in the morning. I'm going to have a car sent to the airport. I'm so mature. I've just got this all figured out. I get out, I get off the plane, and I'm wearing like tons of layers because I basically don't have enough space. And I've got about four big duffel bags. And I remember wearing this huge... vintage jacket that was kind of made out of upholstery material, heavy, and these like yoga pants and boots. And I'm sitting in the back of this car and I'm so excited to get there. I'm like, West Village, here I come. Bayou, I'm going to see Bayou when I get there. It's going to be awesome. And we get in the car and there's kind of, in New York, from JFK, there's this expressway, it's sort of different than a freeway, it's like you get on it and you don't sort of don't get off. So at this point it's about 7:30 in the morning, 8 a.m. You know, beginning of sort of commuting hours of getting into the city. And I get in the car and I'm thinking, "Oh, shoot, shoot, I forgot to pee before I got in the car." Well, thatís fine. Weíll just pull over. And so I say kind of gently, this is like 10 minutes in, Iím realizing wow, itís really, really traffic-y. 45 minutes outside of the city. And traffic, what do you say, Bayou? It's about that? 00:04:45.720 --> 00:04:47.860 I mean, depending on traffic, yeah. Yeah. 00:04:49.160 --> 00:05:35.340 And I think, well, I can, you know, I'm coming from California, a Canadian girl. I'm pretty, you know, pretty nice, pretty polite. I say, excuse me, sir, just when you get a chance, if we could... pull over, I just actually need to use the restroom. He said, no. No stopping till Manhattan. I'm like, okay. And I'm going, wow, really? Like we, and so I kind of wait and like, hmm, how? I like, really? So we get up by the toll place to pay the tolls. And I'm thinking, well, maybe there's a way you could get up here. I said, actually, you know, it's weird, but actually it's kind of an emergency. Like, I really, really have to go. 00:05:37.420 --> 00:05:46.600 And he's like, no, no stopping. I'm like, so he takes, he throws a bag into the back of the car. 00:05:49.240 --> 00:06:16.080 Yeah. And he said, "I understand, just go. Don't worry, I understand. Just go, just go." So I, in broad daylight, in the car, my first moment in New York City, I am pulling these yoga pants, huge jacket, layers, and trying to organize a bag underneath myself to pee and I attempt it, totally fail. 00:06:18.260 --> 00:06:18.780 Absolutely. 00:06:19.680 --> 00:06:45.680 And we get there. I don't even know. I remember, like, throwing the bag. Somehow we threw the bag away before I got to... I get to... We lived on Weehawken Street, shortest street in Manhattan, small fact. And I think, well, and I just knock on the door. I ring the bell, and Bayou comes down in his underwear. 00:06:46.280 --> 00:06:46.800 What? 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:55.520 thinking didn't you think I was coming the next day yeah I think yeah yeah you thought I was like you're coming tomorrow still the fact that I answered 00:06:55.520 --> 00:07:01.100 the door anyway in my underwear is kind of incredible yeah I was free and in my 00:07:01.100 --> 00:07:37.840 20s you always you always bring your underwear totally and I just all I could say was I I'm sorry I had an accident. I just totally smelled like urine. And I'm like, and I'm here. Okay, start. And I'm your roommate. And I'm your roommate. Here we go. Yeah. So that was the beginning of, that's the underwear story and then the beginning of time at Bayou and then we lived we lived we lived in New York for a couple years there and then Bayou ended up living in the space that I was living in there I 00:07:37.840 --> 00:07:53.500 mean if you if you start at that point with just in the filth and in the excrement like you know you know you're you're gonna be good friends after that exactly you cut through all of it and you just get right down to the nitty gritty immediately 00:07:53.500 --> 00:07:55.080 absolutely 00:07:55.080 --> 00:08:04.520 I'm just imagining somebody going up to somebody's door and just peeing in their pants just so they can kind of start off now that we've got that over 00:08:04.520 --> 00:08:07.980 like this is just my personal technique 00:08:07.980 --> 00:08:13.880 break the ice here how to make friends and influence you know, people. 00:08:16.940 --> 00:08:22.160 So Bayou was... So what were you doing at that time? What brought you to New York then? 00:08:23.420 --> 00:08:26.260 Well, I'm trying to think what year it was. That was like 2000. 00:08:26.260 --> 00:08:27.920 2000. It was right before 9-11. 00:08:28.680 --> 00:10:53.700 Right. Yeah, yeah. Well, I had kind of an interesting journey in those couple years because I was... I went to Yale, and at Yale I studied... American Studies which was kind of a potpourri of history, literature, cultural theory and and then I was pre-med as well because I had dabbled with the idea of being a doctor and I always loved science and math and whatnot and then but my true love was the arts. I think I was just I came from no money and I I was putting myself through school by working like three jobs, you know, at like a couple coffee shops and restaurants and whatnot. And I was afraid. I was afraid that, you know, to go into the arts because I knew I had no money and I didn't know how I was going to pay back school. So I did what, you know, any other good Yale student. college person does and says, well, I'm going to go into finance. So I went into finance and I was an equities trader on the NASDAQ for about three years. And, you know, I got in kind of right at the tail end. Basically anybody who started a year before me made like handfuls of money, maybe bag fulls of money, but I came in right at the end, kind of like six months before the dot com bubble burst. So right as I was starting to understand the market and what was going on, everything changed. And I stuck it out for about two and a half years because I've never been a quitter. So I kind of was like, well, even though I don't like this, I'm gonna tough it out and I'm not gonna give up. And I finally came to a point where I said, you know, it's not quitting if you make the conscious decision to alter your course. So I said, you know, I don't like the environment I'm in. and I'm not happy with the people that I'm working with, and this is not the direction I want my life to be in, no matter if it's a good job and the money's great and whatnot. This is not what I want. So I left it, and I did the cliche thing, which was go into restaurants and pursue my acting career. 00:11:12.900 --> 00:11:17.840 and, you know, it was a little bit of a leap of faith, I guess. 00:11:20.300 --> 00:11:21.900 So I left there and then... 00:11:22.640 --> 00:11:28.940 When you went into finance, what was the vision there, like the long-term? 00:11:29.900 --> 00:12:12.600 Well, the vision was that, you know, there was this job that you could work basically market hours, so, you know, 8.30 to 4. And I had friends who were actually artists, you know, singers and whatnot. and they had worked this job for a couple years and they were able to make really good money and then pursue their other things in the evenings and I figured, wow, what a great, like literally a great day job, you know. So one that I could make a lot of money in and then maybe I could pursue my other interests in the evening and I just, you know, like I said, by the time I got there, things had kind of changed. and also I just didn't like it. 00:12:13.660 --> 00:12:19.260 - Right, but the goal had always been to come back to your other interests. 00:12:19.260 --> 00:12:27.700 - Yeah, I think even if it wasn't a goal that I had written down, it was a subconscious goal, yeah. 00:12:27.700 --> 00:12:33.860 and where did when when did were you living in new york at that time or 00:12:33.860 --> 00:12:53.100 was that sort of happening and then yeah so i was living in new york i i moved to new york in the um the fall of 1999 and how old were you um i was i guess i was 20 22 yeah yeah 00:12:53.100 --> 00:12:58.740 And at Yale, did you study acting there? 00:12:59.180 --> 00:18:30.920 I didn't really study acting so much. I minored in theater, which meant that I only had to take, I think, seven courses. So I was able to take a couple acting courses and a couple directing courses, kind of the fun stuff, and a theater history course. But I did do a ton of student productions. And I was a big singer. And I was in a couple of the a cappella singing groups there. And then I did a bunch of musical theater while I was in school. It was basically what I did with all of my extracurricular time is that I just, I sang and I performed. Even if I wasn't studying that, I was doing it with all my other time. So it was, I guess it was, it was a sort of a conservatory through performance that I cultivated for myself while I was there for college. four years. And then when I got out of there and I left the Wall Street job, when I was at the Wall Street job, I started taking classes with some teachers in New York, some mask classes and some other classes with some pretty good teachers, one who had been the head of Yale grad program, which was at the time the probably the most influential program. He was the teacher to, you know, people like, you know, Paul Giamatti and Meryl Streep and, you know, all of the... What's his name or what was... Earl Gister. Earl Gister. Yeah. and he was a big Chekhov buff. So I kind of studied with him for a while. And then finally, and at the same time, I had been auditioning for graduate school. I auditioned for graduate school, I think, four years in a row to get an MFA in acting, and I didn't make it. I got close a couple times, and I didn't make it any of the times. Wow. Yeah and then I ended up doing this summer conservatory at the Shakespeare, the Public Theater which is the Shakespeare theater, Joseph Papp Public Theater in New York and I did the Shakespeare lab which was a summer program but it was funny because I I auditioned for that and I didn't get in, but I got put on the wait list. It's like, all right. So I get to put on the wait list and then I get in off the wait list, you know, very, very late. And one of the teachers for the program was the head of NYU grad acting, which was the place where I really wanted to go. His name was Ron Van Loo and just a beautiful, beautiful teacher and an elegant soul and he um i worked with him for about six weeks and toward the end of it he uh he took me aside and he said you auditioned for nyu this year didn't you and i said yeah yeah i did he's like you're not a very good auditioner i said okay he said but i think you're i think you're very good at auditioning and i said yeah i did and he said yeah i did very good. And we had someone who decided not to matriculate because they got a role in Starship Troopers 2. So we have a spot open in the fall. Would you care to prepare an audition for me and one of the other faculty members? And I said, yeah, I got all excited. And I worked for about a week to prepare something. And a week and a half later, I got a phone call. And this was in August of 2003. A week and a half later, I got a phone call saying, we'd like you to come to NYU Grad Acting in three weeks. What do you think? What do you say? And I was like, okay. Wow. So it kind of airlifted me out of this place I had been in, which was just a bit of a struggle and a holding pattern. I was trying to find my direction and put me into this program that was just filled with love and passion. these amazing teachers and artists that were all focused on your development, your individual development. And it was crazy, I was just listening to something, another podcast recently, and they were talking about imposter syndrome. you know? And when I got there, I totally felt like such an imposter. Like I didn't deserve to be there. Like there were all these other, I was, you know, I was 27. All these other people were there and they were right out of college, 21, and you know, they had auditioned once and blah, blah, blah, and here I was at 27 and I auditioned four times and I didn't even really get in. I kind of got in through a back door because of a you know, a fluke meeting. And I carried that on my shoulders for about a year and a half. And it was really interesting. It wasn't until I was able to let that go that I was able to progress at all. But I think it's, I think it's fascinating. I think it's something that a lot of artists share is that feeling of being an imposter. You know, it's kind of like you have, it's like, wait, I got an award or you're putting my work up at this place or I got a book deal. I don't know if I deserve, this? Should I tell anybody? You know what I mean? Yeah. I don't know. What do you guys think about that? 00:18:31.800 --> 00:19:41.200 I think I've shared this story with you, Sabrina, before, but I remember I went to the School of the Art Institute of Chicago and my first year there, I was in the post-baccalaureate program. I didn't get into the master's program. And I remember we had a meeting with our mentors at their, for a dinner or something, and we went around in a circle, and the question was asked, are you an artist? And almost everybody, said that they weren't sure or that no, they weren't. And it was just kind of this strange, and our mentor has said that that was a common reaction for when that question was asked in that setting. And I don't know if it was just people being shy or not knowing whether or not it would come across. I don't know. It was just kind of a strange, for whatever reason, that none of us felt entirely comfortable even accepting or owning that identity. And here we were, you know, in a great program, you know, one of the top painting programs in the nation. and nobody really wanted to own it. 00:19:41.200 --> 00:20:43.860 I find, you know, I found that it took me a very long time, especially in New York where the number one question is, "What do you do?" You know, after you meet somebody, "So what do you do?" It took me a very long time to say, "Well, I'm an actor." Because I had so many, there were so many things There's so many stigmas about what the response was going to be. Oh, really? Well, what have you been in? What have I seen you in? That kind of thing. And so for a very long time, I'd be like, oh, well, just rattle off a list of things that I did. you know, try to come up with some sort of impressive something to say. But it was really freeing. And yeah, it was just really freeing to finally embrace that fact that I said, no, I'm an actor. What have you, what have I seen you in? Well, I don't know if you've seen me in much, but I'm an actor. and this is what I've done and you know you should try to catch me next time 00:20:43.860 --> 00:20:53.040 exactly what do you think was that turning point for you huh it's an 00:20:53.040 --> 00:20:59.780 interesting question yeah was there like an interaction or was there a 00:20:59.780 --> 00:21:08.000 realization that you made that kind of act as a catalyst to to make that happen or did you just evolve into it 00:21:08.000 --> 00:23:50.460 I think most of it was an evolution. I don't know. I don't know for you two, but as an artist, I'm constantly... That train is a-coming. As an artist, I'm constantly introspective and constantly working on myself to... to stretch more within my skin, to embrace more of the human condition, and also to test myself more and more. And I think that I came to a point after I'd gotten out of graduate school, where things didn't go great for me at first. You know, I got out of graduate school and I was expecting the keys to the kingdom because I had gone to the best graduate school in the country for acting. And I was expecting, and we have this big thing called the showcase or the leagues. And basically it's a, you do two small scenes, two to three minute scenes at the end. your third year in front of an auditorium that's just full of casting directors and agents and whatnot and I got very little response and I was completely distraught and I thought well I spent a hundred thousand dollars on graduate school for what? you know and and it took me a while and to kind of embrace the fact that the journey to where I was and all of the three years of working on myself and working on my craft actually made me a better person regardless of whether I was going to be a successful actor or not, and I couldn't carry that shame anymore about what I thought society thought about me. I had a dialogue in my head. You know, if I said, well, I'm an actor, and they said, well, what have you done? And I said, well, not much. Well, didn't you go to NYU? Well, yeah, so why haven't you done more? Well, I don't know. You know, and this was like a dialogue that I had in my head, which was completely fictitious. It was made up. But it was just, it was fear, you know? And I had to let go of that shame before I could kind of embrace the fact that I was an artist and I had a voice and that I needed to say something and that's why I was doing what I was doing. doing. Does that make sense? 00:23:51.260 --> 00:24:02.800 Absolutely. Sabrina, do you have an internal dialogue or kind of a go-to series of phrases that represent the world or the demon speaker? 00:24:04.680 --> 00:24:56.140 Demon speaker! Hashtag demon speaker. Speak no more, demon speaker. Yeah, I think that's so interesting the way you articulated that, Faye, was very... succinct and resonated so much with me. The idea of there comes a point where you just have to drop it. Like it's like kind of... There's absolutely no use for it, and it's not helping anything, and it's not helping anybody else by carrying that dialogue. I think mine feels like... well, we've talked about this before on the podcast, like, I don't know how, you don't know how to do it, you're not going to do it right, you are too sensitive, 00:25:00.140 --> 00:25:03.400 you can't juggle... 00:25:26.900 --> 00:25:38.820 And it really did, and I'm not allowed to use the word overwhelm anymore, so I cut it out of my vocabulary a couple years ago. Because it's just not, it's useless to say that. 00:25:42.380 --> 00:25:44.240 I... I, 00:25:44.660 --> 00:26:02.160 I, there's a part of me that's fears ever having that feeling again of going, I've got too much on my plate and I'm not handling, I can't handle all of it. So it's, everything's being affected by that. You know, you're spinning too many plates at once. So that concern of, 00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:04.000 uh, 00:26:04.600 --> 00:26:08.000 kind of trying to be very get, 00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:09.500 uh, 00:26:29.700 --> 00:27:28.060 a little bit fuzzy in a lot of different areas, trying to figure out what to be doing next. I had written notes about that, just for all of us to talk about was being a solo creative person in the world and inventing your way through and just keeping it going, having a game plan, having that, and as you're saying, Bayou, about you think, well, if I do this or if I get in there, but say just one year of not getting in, well, then you had a vision of what that next year was going to be like, and that did not happen, so then what do you do? And that as a creative person, it's a different sense of life, you're kind of solo on this like, well, this is the rest of my life. What's the plan? And you can't really totally make a plan. 00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:32.860 I think there's also an interesting intersection of art and commerce, right? 00:27:34.080 --> 00:27:34.600 It's... 00:27:34.600 --> 00:29:37.140 Because when you rely on your heart to pay your bills, then the paradigm shifts a little bit. Yeah. And it... it causes a lot of issues so many so many issues but the thing i always try to remind myself and i have and i struggle with this i i mean i find it challenging is why why are you an artist in the first place. Why are you doing it? Are you doing it just to... Because it would seem sometimes that you're doing it just to beat yourself up. Yeah, exactly. Or it's like, why would you choose this thing that is so hard to do? Do you like living perpetually in angst and anguish? Or is it that, you know, you live for those... moments of inspiration and are you are you here to do something to create or are you here for others approval and I think that's an interesting thing to think about too like why are we doing this for us are we doing it for recognition and if you are doing it for recognition why and also um just that original idea of why are you doing this you know I think that for me acting and written word and being an artist in general is to share the human experience and also to provide catharsis for those who are not as able to communicate. And also, if I wasn't communicating, then I think I would just kind of explode. Like the energies would just kind of start going so fast in my body that I would just explode because I wasn't letting anything out. - Yeah. 00:29:37.140 --> 00:29:37.960 - You know? 00:29:37.960 --> 00:30:02.900 - Yeah. - But I have to remind myself that, especially as an actor, because when you start working commercially, you know, it's about money and the bottom line, and finding the art in those situations is often more challenging. And I guess that's where I'm at now, you know? 00:30:02.900 --> 00:30:59.540 Are there activities or projects that you're involved in where the separation between art and commerce is a little bit more cut and dry? What do you mean by that? Meaning that maybe you're doing projects on the side that aren't necessarily for money, where you have maybe a little bit more autonomy or a little bit more control. Are there ways, I don't know, I'm just trying to think of, is it always this tension between feeling like there's compromise being made or there's some kind of negative aspect that you're having to accept because of just the realities of existence? Or are you able, you personally, are you able to find ways to be involved in things that feel more pure? I don't know, maybe that's even a false distinction. I'm kind of searching for the right question in my mind right now. 00:30:59.540 --> 00:31:26.320 - I think I understand where you're going. And yes, I have been able to find ways to, follow my artistry without having it be related to commerce. And those are usually the most joyful experiences. But primarily, I would say to anyone who's an artist, even though there's sometimes a stigma to doing it, 00:31:27.780 --> 00:31:28.400 teach. 00:31:28.400 --> 00:31:55.260 teaching others or coaching others is often the purest form for me because in that teaching of others, I have to hold myself to the highest standards of what I've learned in order to pass it on to somebody else. And I remind myself of... what I've learned and I remind myself by teaching 00:31:57.560 --> 00:32:16.060 the ways to actually go about the artistic experience, which I often will forgo or shortcut sometimes when working on my own. And it's only through teaching or coaching others that I hold myself to those higher standards. And I often get so much out of it as an artist. 00:32:16.060 --> 00:32:55.560 - I personally have found, in addition to what you just said, I think that's spot on, but I think also teaching you're constantly faced with those questions of why. You're constantly finding yourself, 'cause I think all students are fundamentally everyday asking themselves those questions. And I think you have to, to some degree, answer that. in everything you teach, you know, is why are we even here in the first place? I don't know. I find myself bolstering or trying to reinforce that foundation of why we're even here in the first place in my own teaching. And I find that that's often just trying to talk, you know, reinforce that in myself. 00:32:56.420 --> 00:32:57.820 Mm-hmm. Yeah. 00:32:58.900 --> 00:33:01.900 Yeah, why are we here and... 00:33:01.900 --> 00:33:03.620 What is it about? 00:33:03.620 --> 00:33:51.840 What is it about and how do we choose to spend our time? Right? My mother passed away this last year. And it was obvious... Well, maybe not obviously. Everyone's experience is subjective. It's completely their own experience. But it was really hard. I had never experienced grief like that. It was textbook. I went through the five stages, the five levels of grief, and I didn't even know that I was going through them at the time. And it made me question, you know, I had this knee-jerk reaction. Like, well, life is so fleeting and, you know, why am I doing this thing that doesn't really mean anything? 00:33:52.860 --> 00:33:55.060 You know? Hi. 00:33:56.520 --> 00:33:58.440 Let me take you guys. Keep going. 00:33:59.120 --> 00:34:29.500 But, you know, why am I doing this thing that doesn't really... have any tangible purpose, right? But I think that's just a knee jerk reaction. And later I kind of found that I'm choosing to do it because I want to express my experience and this is how I choose to live. I choose to live through this self expression. 00:34:29.500 --> 00:35:06.360 I think there's also, I think you bring up a point that there is, I feel like there's a lot of kind of built-in talk or kind of under implication in just our value structure in the United States, in a capitalist economy where we kind of see money as the indicator of what's really important, right? So it's like if you're doing anything that doesn't result in you making money, you're kind of being selfish and you're not contributing, you're not doing something that has value, you know? 00:35:06.560 --> 00:35:07.060 Right. 00:35:07.260 --> 00:35:57.700 And I don't know, I think that kind of seeps into the mentality or psychology of artists. I think we kind of pick that up from society that we're not doing something that is valuable. And then that's why you get questions like, well, why am I even doing this? You know, it's selfish. It's just about me. It's about my expression, and it's not adding anything. But I think given much additional thought, you and I would probably both agree that that's not true, that there is value. you know, to the larger society of the things that we're pursuing. And it's not a selfish thing at all. It's, you know, it's something to bring things into the world that are honest and beautiful and truthful and, you know, essentially adding to the human experience. 00:35:58.860 --> 00:36:03.540 - Well, it's about connection and it's about sharing, 00:36:03.540 --> 00:36:05.040 I think. - Absolutely. 00:36:05.040 --> 00:36:06.700 - And, 00:36:06.700 --> 00:37:15.580 more and more I think you can go on in a capitalist society and be completely self uh contained and think only about your own personal you know journey getting to the top of it your little mountain and right showing all of your stuff and at the top and um I don't know. I guess I've never been like that. So I don't know. Maybe it is extremely fulfilling. Maybe there's something really great about it. But I find that my favorite moments are moments of shared experience with other people, often strangers, that lets me know that there is an energy and a a relationship that we all have to each other just on being on this planet and living where we live and living, you know? I think those are the experiences that are the most fruitful. 00:37:17.400 --> 00:37:18.820 - Yeah. 00:37:19.920 --> 00:38:05.120 - You guys are so great. - I did this little web series a couple years ago and it was funny 'cause I put it up on the internet and then you never know who watches it. But like, people watch. You put stuff on the internet and it finds its way. And I was getting comments from, you know, kids in Southeast Asia who are saying, I'm sorry, my English is not very good, but thank you for writing my experience. And, you know, and for me, regardless whether, you know, it did well or got any attention, that was the most... inspired part of it was that somebody else from halfway around the world, you know, said thank you because that resonated with me. 00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:06.540 Yeah. Yeah. 00:38:08.720 --> 00:39:08.500 But I was, I was talking to, um, you know, I was talking to Sabrina and we were talking also about, you know, body and breath and voice and, um, I think that one of the major things that we learned at an acting conservatory at NYU was that, or grad school, was that, you know, everything starts with a breath and kind of relaxation. And I found that that has helped me so much in my life in general. the since since learning it you know if you don't breathe if you hold your breath if you hold muscular tension you don't let things in and nothing can really affect you so I find even when I'm like driving down the streets of Los Angeles and I get really frustrated if I can kind of just let go of my physical tension and a second then I can realize that it's not a big deal I don't have to react to it 00:39:08.500 --> 00:40:10.020 I don't it's interesting because I I've been um seeing this chiropractor and I almost being yelled at every session he said you have got to breathe you're in touch because I this issue going down the left side of my body that I've had for on my left hand and left foot and I've had it for a couple years now and he's like this is all because you're not breathing like the muscle tension that is happening is because you're holding your breath and I think it's completely body you know muscle memory and And I catch it all day long. I'm like, I don't know how I'm alive still. I mean, I'm not inhaling and exhaling in a way that is... And I think about it. I think all of us can relate to just these times where things have gotten really, really stressful for a really long, grating amount of time. 00:40:11.640 --> 00:40:12.200 Um... 00:40:12.200 --> 00:40:53.180 Trent and I and Bayou, I mean, with all the past couple years, it's just the anxiety, the amount of holding my breath and being concerned and anxious and unsure has just, it feels like I feel that in my body and I really feel committed to... to getting, figuring that out and taking care of that because it's so detrimental to every part, every aspect of what you're creating to the way you're thinking, the way, you know. 00:40:54.240 --> 00:41:01.920 Yeah, I think that, well, I was, I was saying, you know, when my mother passed and after she did, 00:41:02.420 --> 00:41:03.160 it wasn't, 00:41:03.600 --> 00:43:07.040 I was depressed for a while and I kind of stopped doing anything artistically for quite a bit and I also realized that I kind of stopped doing anything physically and it made me realize how much in retrospect how divorced I was from my body and when you're divorced from your body you're kind of stuck in your head and your head your mind kind of takes control and you can get into those places of spinning, you know, and having those conversations with yourself. And, and, um, and it's a really dangerous place to be because you, maybe not even, I don't know, it could be dangerous. It could also just be unfortunate place to be because you, you start, you, you know, you kind of create false narratives for yourself. And, and instead of, and you bring those false, and then you can end up bringing those false narratives into fruition, you know. And what really helped me, and I had never done it before, was just starting to meditate. I honestly just sat down for 10 minutes a day and started to meditate, and that reminded me to come back to my breath. And then, you know, pretty soon, I was able to stop the head from ticking. and then pretty soon I was out exercising. And I think if you're an artist, regardless, you should be exercising, whether it's going to a gym or going for a walk, you know, just to be moving physically to allow breath to come in and out while you're using your body. I think if you do that, you know, if you have a dog or something, get up in the morning, go for a little walk and then come back, you're so much more prepared. to create after that, I believe, because you've engaged your central nervous system, you've started the blood flowing, and you've, you know, relaxed your muscles just by taking, trying to be present and taking in other things. I've noticed that that's been a game changer for me. 00:43:07.200 --> 00:43:26.700 fine I'll go on a walk Jesus you are speaking right to like a big like my conscience tells me every day like you need to get out and just be more physically active and 00:43:42.500 --> 00:44:33.520 was end gaming a little bit. Being like, well, I don't have time to run like two miles right now, so it probably wouldn't be helpful just to run like a half a mile, or I've only got time to walk 10 minutes, and what is 10 minutes really going to do? Exactly, right. And then literally you walk outside your door and see a tree, and look at the sky and look at a dog passing by and all of a sudden, you're like, oh, as long as you're present where you are, that's really all you need. You just need to get out of your house for a second and take in some fresh air. And I think it's a big game changer. So, Trent, I'm speaking to you. You live in Santa Monica. It's beautiful. 00:44:36.340 --> 00:44:39.360 I have no excuse. 00:44:42.480 --> 00:44:45.900 Oh. Well. Yeah. 00:44:45.900 --> 00:44:49.980 Thank you, Bayou. Really. 00:44:50.740 --> 00:44:51.860 It was nice to talk to you guys. 00:44:52.460 --> 00:44:53.040 Yeah, likewise. 00:44:54.500 --> 00:44:57.940 I feel... I miss you, friend. 00:44:58.280 --> 00:45:00.420 I miss you, too, sister in arms. 00:45:00.720 --> 00:45:06.200 I was just going to say brother in arms. Higher straights. Ha ha ha. 00:45:06.200 --> 00:45:51.320 Thank you so much to Vayu for taking the time to talk with us. It was a fantastic conversation and one that I've been thinking about since we recorded it last week. I wanted to share something that's been on my mind since we had the conversation, something that he said that I thought was worth ending with. He said something to the effect of, you have to let go of the shame in order to realize your potential as an artist. And something, I don't know, that felt like something very profound to me these past several days as I've thought about it. In our culture, for whatever reason, artists pick up and tend to feel this kind of shame for wanting to create. 00:45:51.620 --> 00:46:07.120 The shame of trying to figure it out. You know, shame that goes around like it's hard to figure out. It's hard to... you know, there's no cut and dry path of how to do it right. And I think shame can come from that too. 00:46:07.520 --> 00:46:34.200 And I don't think, I think he's right. I don't think we're as artists that we will realize our full potential unless we can somehow rid ourselves of that weight, that burden of shame that can seep in all too easily. And so I wanted to thank Faiyu for... for that comment and planting that thought in my brain because I think it's a great one. 00:46:36.780 --> 00:47:27.380 That's it for this week guys. Thank you for listening. You can find show notes for this episode at roomthetrees.com. There's some really good ones this week. You can support us by subscribing for $5 a month at patreon.com forward slash room and there's random outtakes and some other extra funny stories and just recordings that we have that we'll be sharing with you there. And if you have a moment, it really helps us to reach more people and just... keep the conversation going. If you'd rate us on iTunes or leave a comment, we love them. They make our day. And Trent's brother, Brent provided the music for the podcast. You can hear more of his awesome music at soundcloud.com. And there's a link in the show notes to to that. And next week, what are we talking about? What's going on? 00:47:28.120 --> 00:47:44.040 Next week, we are talking to David Lloyd, who is a fantastic abstract painter based here in LA. And he teaches classes here on Saturdays. So we look forward to a conversation with him. Awesome. 00:47:44.900 --> 00:47:51.920 Now let's go and make shamelessly.