Trenton ReynoldsThis is Dabalon. My name is Trent Reynolds, and in this podcast, I have conversations with artists about materials. If you are enjoying this podcast and want it to continue, please subscribe or make a one-time contribution at dabalon.com forward slash podcast. leave a five-star rating on iTunes, and tell all the friends. The longevity of this program very much depends on your support, and I thank you. In this episode, my guest is Todd Squires, owner and founder of Fourth Corner Conservation, a fantastic framing shop in Santa Monica, California. I've come to know Todd because he is my studio neighbor. Over the past few years we have talked on occasion, he has framed work for some of my studio mates, and I've peeked in his shop many times to see what he's working on. Back when we first moved into the studio he was framing something for Ed Ruscha, so I have been aware for a while that he makes frames for some big names in the art world, but only recently I found out that he is also an accomplished artist. with an impressive breadth of experience. So I asked him if he would be willing to join me for a conversation. Here is my conversation with artist Todd Squires.
Todd SquiresWell, I grew up in an art family basically. My father was a lithographer, master lithographer, got his master at Tamarind. That's New Mexico, famous for lithography, right? Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it's still there, and the institute's still there, and they're still teaching it. I grew up in this house that was just full of art from all different areas, but he was close from the very beginning with Ed Ruscha because he automatically started working in these different print houses like Cirrus and Gemini for a short time, and then eventually for an artist named June Wayne for a number of years. But throughout all that time, he was always friends with Ed Ruscha, and so as a consequence, Ed Ruscha was like a family friend as I was growing up. And so it just seemed like when I started to do, get into, develop a personality of my own, of course art was gonna be related, that sort of independent spirit and everything else. And so yeah, so as luck would have it, or as it would go, I do frame a lot of stuff for art. of Ed Ruscha's work. A lot of people know that I'm the guy that knows how to frame his prints the way that he likes them. And, but I frame other artists. I mean, you name it, I've done almost every living contemporary artist along and recently passed. I've done Monet's, I've done Rembrandt's, I've done Botero's. And that was sort of a, and each time it's sort of a flick. Plenty of Picasso, but if you name a famous artist, there may very well have been a time that I've framed one of their pieces, even Nagel. Wow. Yeah.
Trenton ReynoldsThat's kind of... Maybe you're kind of acclimatized to it now or accustomed to it now. Is there kind of an awe, a feeling of awe when you get pieces from these famous artists or does it just feel like business?
Todd SquiresOccasionally, it's... I mean... because of the fact that I've been around it since I was first born I think it's it's it's less of an awe and more of an inspiration you know like because I'm an artist myself and so I see these pieces come into my shop and some of them just jump off the page or the canvas and influence me and give me ideas for other things. And on some things you can just see the sort of the spirituality dance right off of the piece and just take the room over. And like, you know, once I finish things, because what I try to do is I try to do everything with a minimal approach when it comes to framing because I don't think framing should have any impact on the artwork. I think that what the frame should do is basically emphasize the artwork and make it look better without actually even being seen almost. It should be this invisible thing that just pushes it even further out. And so when people don't notice my frames, I take it as a compliment because they're looking at how amazing the artwork is. So, once I get them framed and then I'll have them out, like you can see over here, there's a couple Ed Ruscha prints that are exactly the same. I'll leave them out and sometimes I'll put something in front of them because they're not necessarily inspiring anything and I just want the client to come and pick it up. But other times I'll leave it exposed because every time I walk by it, I'll look over it and go, "Wow. That's great. And then the next thing you know, I'll put my framing aside and then I'll work on something of my own.
Trenton ReynoldsLet's talk more about your own artwork. And maybe before that, though, let's go back to growing up in the house of a master lithographer. I imagine that
Todd SquiresLike he was a good parent in the sense. I mean technically he is my He's not my biological father, but he was pretty much there since I was born So he's he raised me as his own. So yes, he's he's my dad as I say But I He was a good dad and my mom was a good mom in the sense that they tried to give me direction but they didn't want to impose what they did in their life on me. They didn't say, "I did it this way so you should do it that way." Also, they really, really, really wanted me to find my own path. And it didn't matter what it was. They didn't say you need to be a doctor if you want to make money. You need to do this if you want to do... Maybe there was a little encouragement to take business school here and there, but just so that I would have a sense of finance. But they had a great sense of finance as well, which is very sort of... As long as you keep your finances as minimal as possible, you can pursue greater things. Sure. To some people, maybe that is just finances. I mean, you know. But anyway, so when I was growing up, there would be like, you know, my school sometimes would organize classes that would go to his print shop, wherever it was at the time. And he would show... how prints were made and everything else, and a lot of times people's eyes would glaze over because it's such a monotonous, disciplined art. Like he hates it when somebody says, oh, so this isn't an original, because in his mind it is totally, or each and every single print that he pulls off that press is an original. because it took an extreme amount of collaboration between himself and the artist in order to get to that particular image. And then each image just requires so much meticulous scrutiny to the point where if he pulls something off and he sees just the slightest wrong dot or ink spot or something that most people wouldn't even notice, he just tears it up. and just goes to the next one. And even if it's already got like three previous runs of ink already on it that have dried so that he could do this fourth run. And that particular kind of patience, I have plenty of patience in my own life and I have plenty of discipline in my own life. But I think that there really is something where we're born into this world and we have a gift. I think we're born with this gift and it's our... duty to find that gift, to find that path. And a lot of times it's not exactly the same thing that our parents do, but as it reveals itself to us, we know it. And a lot of times it doesn't reveal it, and so with printmaking it didn't.
Trenton ReynoldsRight, right. So at a young age, did you get a sense, I guess you're saying that your parents kind of encouraged you in that way to find your own voice, but did you have a sense that lithography or printmaking wasn't quite the right fit and that there was something else that you were searching for? Or was there kind of a discontent with...
Todd SquiresYeah, I never felt like I wanted to be a lithographer, but I did want to be an artist who worked with my father at some point, which of course I ended up doing, because you put that into your mind and a lot of times you can make it happen. But yeah, so so but it was definitely more artistic, you know related you know as far back as I can remember my mom had a dark room and And one day they put a camera in my hand and and that was like the best thing that I've ever seen. I You know, I grew up loving music and movies and everything else and I actually wanted to be a filmmaker But I think that was more related to the camera that I received Was it immediate like you you get the camera you start taking pictures?
Trenton ReynoldsWas there just like this feeling like you'd found your your voice? I mean, it was yeah at that particular stage in life
Todd SquiresYeah, yeah And what was it? What do you think that was? I don't know. It was just like the magic of being able to reproduce a memory and reproduce an image that was in this real world. And then, of course, that's what eventually got me fascinated in other pursuits like drawing and painting and all that other stuff. But the thing that I stuck to most was, yeah, some sort of like photographic representation of something, you know. But in an artistic way, like I did not want to reproduce. I didn't want to... You know, I had a short professional career as a photographer, but it just it wasn't you know and then I went to film school and I and I wanted to be like a director because I loved the idea of just creating these experiences for people and And then slowly, little by little, that sort of got jaded because I realized just how commercial-minded the entire industry is, which does not fall on my sort of independent creative spirit. And... And I realized that the thing that I loved the most when I was in film school was the sort of the breaking down aspect of the different elements of filmmaking and criticism in that particular regard. I guess I didn't really want to be a film critic, but I wanted to be able to. appreciate films more by sort of putting together this puzzle that the filmmaker creates that are it's so subtle like every filmmaker that that's would call himself an auteur creates this this thing and that's what i was drawn to and and and it's our and just like when we look at a painting or a rembrandt or whatever it is like it's kind of our job to dismantle it and figure out what it is that they're either trying to say or what it is that it's saying to us, you know, and that obviously goes to the
Trenton Reynoldsliterature as well. Did you find that the process of creating your own movies or your own video or whatever, I don't know what to what extent that you you were involved in that, did that help you feel more connected to that process of understanding, connecting with, you know, film of the past? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah. I went to... And you ultimately found that more meaningful than pursuing, you know, becoming a director
Todd Squiresyourself and engaging with this whole commercial... Yeah, yeah. I mean, I liked being, like, I had a hard time, like, I enjoyed working with others, but I enjoyed... being the one who was basically guiding other people along and saying, "This is maybe how we should do this." You know what I mean? Like, I didn't really want to follow somebody else's vision. I always wanted to be mine. And of course, therein is the problem when you're working in film. So, like, when I was making these short films, when I was in college, we would put the group together and then somebody would come up with a script and we would look at the script together and we'd say, "Okay, let's change this and this and this and this." And then eventually, I said I will be the cinematographer of course, but then we would go to the set and I would start filming things and then I would kind of start to direct things. And then I would start to get other people involved and then when it was time to edit, I would create the sort of the entire thing for the editor to do, where like I would get like all these VHS tapes and things you know, take the 16 millimeter and commit it to VHS so that I could edit two things and then say this is what it should look like and I'd even put a soundtrack on it and then the editor would do it exactly that way and and then I would come into the editing bay and kind of change things too and say what if we did this like if we scratch the film it looks like a bullets coming out of the gun which it did and you know, so and so That was the thing. I just wanted to kind of like have my hand in everything.
Trenton ReynoldsRight, right. It's been my wife and I have been watching the Get Back documentary series. And it's so interesting to
Todd Squireswatch Paul
Trenton Reynoldsright, cause he's always like he's kind of telling like the drums need to sound something like this. He wants to
Todd SquiresThat's an interesting song, George. Right.
All right.
Todd SquiresLet's move on now. Right, right. That's nice. Yeah. No, I agree. It was amazing.
Trenton ReynoldsBut there's something to, you know, I think some people... are able to compartmentalize the creative vision right where they can see like just one part of a larger hole and there are others that see the The hole right it's like and are able to kind of get a larger vision and it's hard if you're one of those people to seed the kind of sub-components out to other people, right? Because you want it to come together in a certain way.
Todd SquiresYeah, I think to a certain extent, it's like, I mean, there's a million different ways of putting it, but, you know, and I don't mean to sort of bring a specific, you know, God into this, but I think that it's just like, I think it's just like, it's like when you, you can feel it when God's speaking through you, you know what I mean? And so, and you've, and, and, and there is this weird thing of enlightenment and there's this hand pushing you and it won't let you stop until you get to a point where either you either have to stop or you can just pick up and do it, you know? So photography
Trenton Reynoldscaptures you first, that's your first love or the first resonance maybe that you feel. What, uh, as far as like, artistic pursuits and materials, what comes next? What's after photography?
Todd SquiresYeah, I tried different mediums and then started taking a lot of art classes so that I could learn how to just do a lot of the basic things in order to express myself and realize this wasn't going to work for me. Kevin: and this wasn't going to work for me. And then I got out of school and just started working in film and just said, this isn't going to work for me. I mean, photography was always there. Like when I was in high school, I learned how to develop all the film and do all that stuff, and I shot for the yearbook and a million things. But it was always this sort of thing that just kind of, you know, like you need that thing to fall back on. or else you just feel like, you know, well at least for me, like something's being wasted. Like my life is being wasted unless I create something. And so photography was something I would fall back on. And then I get into film school and I'm being mentored, like in between, you know, semesters, I'm being mentored by this guy who's a conservation frame maker, so I was like doing that, you know, along the way and I was just like, "Oh, this is kind of a cool thing, this framing thing." And then eventually I graduated, started working, and in between jobs I continued to to sort of, you know, work at this little frame shop. And then, you know, you have that thing, a lot of us have this thing, I was just listening to this woman describe This woman who sort of has a PhD in psychology and spirituality, crazily enough, who can document that there is spirituality that exists. And she was describing it as this thing where you're walking down this path and suddenly you get to this door and you walk through it and then you realize it's not for you and it becomes this red door. Yeah. And a lot of times when that red door slams on you and you feel like the world's going to end, this yellow door opens up and you realize this was meant for me so much more. And maybe there's a person present that kind of like, you know, guides you or whatever else and they're considered a trail angel, I think was the term, which I really kind of like that idea. And so yeah, that happened with film where I was just, I can't do this. So I just, it was zapping my soul. I was becoming an asshole. And I was going all over the country and living in different places for those short amount of time when you like, you know, do independent films and different things like that.
Trenton ReynoldsIt wasn't nourishing my soul. The framer that you ended up working with, would you call him a trail angel? Was he someone where a door opened up and it was...
Todd SquiresSure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like a trail angel. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I like the people that work there and everything and I was really kind of enjoying myself. It was funny though because I had different people, including the owner of that shop, come up to me and tell me, "You're doing a great job and I can see you're having a good time, but I can also see that you need to be doing your own thing." which was very strange. And then at one point, and it sort of came on suddenly and then it happened slowly little by little, it was incredibly sad. He had passed away, the owner of the shop, and rather than take the shop over 'cause the family didn't really wanna give it up, I went and started my own place and just this place here since 2003 and just thought, okay, well now I have my own studio. I have my own thing. And so this was the yellow door that kind of opened. Right. And I opened the shop at the very beginning with this woman named Rhonda. who was sort of the bookkeeper at the old place. And so she came with me, and she was sort of maybe a trail angel in that sense because she basically reaffirmed to me, made me believe that I could do this. You know, when you go and try to start something new like this, it's just like it's one of the scariest things you can possibly do because I had no idea what I was getting into. I never ran a business, you know.
Trenton ReynoldsSo obviously you connected with framing enough to want to keep doing it, right? Yeah. What is it about framing?
Todd Squires- I love that aspect of like, just like you do, of like crafting something with your hands, you know, and as monotonous as it becomes, like my father's profession, there is something about like, you know, just guiding these tiny little nail brads into this tiny little piece of wood, and over time developing this, this, this kind of appreciation for it. Almost like it's some sort of meditation or a practice. As soon as it starts to become a little too monotonous where I'm not paying enough attention, I put everything down and I walk away. And even if it has to be for a day or two, then that's just what needs to happen. But it always has to feel like something that I can be proud of. And I think that a lot of things, like I don't really do it to get recognition from the people who necessarily have me frame it too, because there's a lot of that too. It's just like, "Oh great, my artwork's done. People pick up their stuff, they don't care." But that's the thing, that's the stoic in me that just kind of enjoys doing it, and not necessarily for the fruit, but just because I enjoy the practice, you know, if that makes any sense.
Trenton ReynoldsWell, I'm sitting here thinking, I'm trying to reconcile these two things of Todd, the filmmaker, wanting to own the whole product and have this, to see this vision, and Todd, the frame maker, who's okay with letting your work or your contribution kind of just... dissolve into the periphery, right?
Todd SquiresMaybe that's the collaboration aspect that I did pick up from my dad. Right. But it's the one time I can tolerate it.
Right.
Trenton ReynoldsYeah. Right. Well, and it's kind of a... It's collaborative, but it's also a giving in its right. Like, it's also a, like... Or a celebration of somebody else, right? Like, I don't know. There's something... I feel that coming from you. I don't know if that's the right way of saying it, but I feel like... it seems like you get some enjoyment from making others artwork look good. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. And, and respecting it by doing your best, you know, and getting,
Todd Squiresyou know, I, a lot, it's, it's, it's, it's, I think it's important to get bored. And nobody ever gets bored anymore because we've got our devices and these things. But when I'm back there, and occasionally I'll get bored, and that is important because it allows me to figure out whatever it is that, like, it opens my mind to the 8 million things that I could possibly be doing that's creative and sort of, you know, feeding my soul even further. And so, like, in that process, so, like, these pieces up here on the wall... I would sort of, you know, like I envisioned those one day. Like I was outside in the alley and I saw this truck had gone by and just obliterated like a soda can or something. Oh, no, it was like a piece of, you know, a rain gutter. And I took that rain gutter and it looked like, It went from this functional thing of being a rain gutter to, you know, like this Duchampian moment where it was like it turned into this beautiful S-curve that I thought needed to be accentuated so I would like mount it to something and then I painted it in such a way that it had some like more dimension, like light was illuminating it, like one of these things. And then, you know, thus begun this whole thing. string of different things, like that's a coffee pot smashed up and that's an Altoids tin. And then there's like a cool ready whip thing over there. So describe what we're looking at here.
Trenton ReynoldsThese are photographs? They're resin? No, no, no.
Todd SquiresThat's the thing is that part of my photography sort of like need to stay with photography was I created these photo realistic looking kind of actual sculptures. So, like, that's actual glass in there, and that's a tin, and it's completely embedded in resin, which I know you also love.
Trenton ReynoldsYeah, I was gonna say that this, and maybe talk me through how you got there, because I was over here the other day talking to you, and I had no idea that you did anything other framing, right? Right, yeah. You started talking about resin. I'm like, wait a second. How do you get... Like, resin is a... It's not such a hard thing to pick up, but it requires a certain amount of commitment, right? Oh, yeah, yeah. So how did you get... You saw this thing smashed on the ground. You liked the curve. You wanted to do something with it.
Todd SquiresSo yeah, I would create these monochromatic things and then I would paint them in such a way that they became three-dimensional like objects on moons or something and you didn't know really what it was until you found out. And then I would sometimes I'd use plexi so you could turn some of these around and you could see the thing. And I don't even have most of these anymore because I sold a lot of them so these are just the ones that are kind of left over. But the way that I got to resin one day, that particular piece and there's actually another piece in there and a few others that sold in New York, was because I had to use resin to join some of my frames, that like the five minute epoxy, but it was a sort of a similar compound. And then one day I was at a, Nailers, you know Nailers? It's down on Lincoln. It's like a paint store I would always go to and get supplies from. And they had these like gallon-fold, two-part resin things. And I thought, "That's interesting. What would somebody use that for?" And then I saw there were like people made tabletops out of them. And then I went to this show for this artist named Dustin Yellen. Love his work. Yeah. Yeah. And I was blown away by his work. And I thought, okay, that just answered everything. And so I went and I bought like, you know, the gallons of the stuff. And rather than do what he did, which is like drawing and then resin, drawing, resin, drawing, resin, drawing, resin. I did try that a little bit like at the beginning just to see what it would look like. And I said, no, this is what I need to do. I need to encase some of them in resin and just kind of create this whole kind of cool three-dimensional look. Yeah. So the frame is in these, in every single one of my pieces is the artwork. Like you can't separate them or else they'll fall apart. You know, which I kind of dig so that's employing the practice into the art, right?
Trenton ReynoldsYeah, and all right. Is this a continuing series? Is this something that you go back to or is it is kind of a completed thought? Yeah, it's a totally completed thought
Todd SquiresYeah, like I might actually revisit it again one day there. I do have some ideas I might try so there's this sort of on the back burner, but then after this I because I had this acute love of film since I was a little kid too, you know, and that's part of the reason why I wanted to be a filmmaker. My mom was taking me to see films since I was three years old. And like, you know, I'm seeing Bergman films when I was seven years old and starting to understand, you know, depressing, weird, Swedish nihilism and getting it and totally loving it. Like running home in third grade so I can finish watching a Stanley Kubrick film, which is like most people would say, "That's not how you raise a kid," but no, it's how you raise me. I wouldn't watch horror films. My wife can't watch a horror film unless I'm with her. And she's like, "How can you watch this and not be scared?" And I say, "Because there's a boom guy over there." There's, you know what I mean? But the creative process, look at the shot, Sharon. Like the cinematographer had to set this up with the director and then you see how it's yellow over there, that yellow is supposed to represent decay. You know what I mean? So, in order to employ some of that, and here's the thing is that, you know, sometimes, I'm sure this happens with you all the time, you're just doing your own thing and then something, you see something like go to a Dustin Yellen show. and you're suddenly like, this light bulb goes off and you're just like, that's awesome, but I'm gonna do this, right? Even if it's something completely non-related. So I saw the movie Cloverfield and it's not that it was, like it was a fun movie to watch, the monster movie, and all told, like in Blair Witch style, cinema verite. But I loved the concept that it was a tape that was found, like under a bridge, and then they watched it, and it was like the military released it, and they watched it. And you're watching this like tape, but every now and then it'll... blip and you're because it was like the particular parts were like recorded over like When this couple went to the ferris wheel whatever and then it goes back to you know watching the the monster come in and then it blips back and like maybe they're at a wedding and it's just like and I and I think like That's kind of how our minds work, that's what life is. And I wanted to kind of create that kind of experience. So I started getting VHS tapes and crumpling up the tape and making static and then trying to buy digital static here and there. And then I started to find like old nostalgic drive-in movie ads and videos and then, you know, like with like little blips of porn and, you know, just like things that I know that like just hit my mind just like randomly throughout the day and created these sort of like five minute on average vignettes and where I'm taking something that exists. But a lot of times I would incorporate my own video too. It's like, oh, the particular mood I need right there, I'm going to have to go out and film that. And then you'll see American Idol and then all of a sudden, and then I would weave it all together with some song that would just kind of hold the whole thing together. And I decided, okay, I'm going to be known as an anonymous video artist, ReadyMade777, because I'm putting... so much of myself in there that I needed to be anonymous. Like I did not... It was too vulnerable to... Yeah. And I'm not one of those people that needs like the recognition. And I don't, because I don't do this for the recognition. I do this to like have other people appreciate it. but not necessarily have a face to go with it or an identity to go with it. Like, you know what I mean? Like I don't need like that egotistical, Todd, you're a great artist. So I had this show at one point where I started uploading all these on the YouTube and I started to create this kind of cool fan base. And I would start to incorporate them into my videos. Like fans would send me videos and I would put them into my videos. and they love that. It was just so, it was like me giving back artistically to all these people that were inspired by me. And then I had this like a show where I went to New York and I was given a gallery and I completely sort of transformed it into like a living room. I went to Salvation Army and got this and that and little trays and stuff like that. And I put stuff up on the wall. And then I had these little TVs and then a big projection for the main thing. And then when it was the night of the thing, all these gallerists were there. And they all had T-shirts on that said, I am ready-made. Because my name was Ready-Made 777. Right. And I was just a person that was there to enjoy the show like everyone else that came to the show to see it. So nobody knew it was me. Oh my gosh, that's awesome. So I could go around and I could listen to people say, I'm not so sure about this one. But, oh, did you see that? That was from Stanley Kubrick. That was from Clavik Orange. Oh, wait, look, I love how they do. Oh, look how they're doing that. And whether they hated it or liked it, I'm hearing like the real... opinions of things and that was like so much fun. Yeah. Wow. Yeah.
Trenton ReynoldsDo you still maintain that community or is that a complete thought?
Todd SquiresNo, no. I eventually had to, because a lot of it was, because I thought YouTube was such a perfect thing because I'm also making statements about media and how it just like takes over our brains just like the phones have, but this was pre-smartphone, but YouTube was starting take over our brains so I decided why not just post them all on YouTube and Then eventually because of all of the copyright stuff that YouTube started Instituting and this and that and this and that they just started getting taken down and taken down I mean, I have them all, you know on like CD-ROM and and like a big hard disk or whatever, but But yeah, and then I eventually reached the point where it's just like okay, and that's the completion of a thought right now
Trenton ReynoldsYeah I think that's interesting. Sometimes there is a conclusion, right? Like sometimes a thought wraps up and it feels done, right? And sometimes it never closes, right? It's just kind of this perpetually open... I was about to ask you if you considered these film projects or these combined video media projects, if you consider those ready-mades, and obviously you do because you called yourself ready-made. Yeah, yeah. So you've done resin, you've done ready-made both in video and in physical objects.
Todd SquiresWhat else have you been... I need to get out there and... And express myself it's through some form of photography or like little, you know quick little short films and like you were in one of them
Trenton ReynoldsYeah, you described that so you did a series. Yeah. Yeah
Todd SquiresYeah when the and and it took the pandemic for this particular project to get sparked up and that was in April of 2020 when everything just shut down and I thought to myself, I want to somehow document this because this is very meaningful to the human race. But I didn't, everyone else was documented somehow and I know that there was like a million filmmakers writing scripts at that very moment, even though it was just like, you know, day But I thought, why not just document it by just randomly recording one second every single day and then posting 30 seconds at the end of each month and doing it that way. And yeah, that's what I ended up doing. And it's just so eerie and stark to watch the first couple of months. You know like I would go to the observatory and I would just take a second of like the yellow tape that was stretched across and then I would be at a crosswalk where I was making a left and and You can't see anything on the streets and you just hear that the left turn click click click You know, it was a while before we started wearing masks and then there's like a second of me wearing a mask and and And then you can kind of see, like, I did it so that it was like a year from April 2020 to April 2021, where I just put them all together, and then you can kind of see this, and to see it that way, you know, it's like when you write a journal and then you go back like a year and go, I'm glad I'm not worrying about that anymore, whatever it is. It's fun to kind of like go back and reflect of course and see and just go wow. It's so crazy to see how things change and I'm sure that there's like a second here and there that people would see because I did get a lot of sort of great reaction from that. That this one little second kind of represented so much of someone's life. Like this close-up of my wife pouring wine vigorously into a glass. You know, just like little things like that that represented what we were all dealing with and what we all did and then meaningful things that were just independent to me. Yeah, and then you were in it because at the end of each month I decided to get somebody to say that's whatever month it was. Right, right. So, of course, everyone over at your artist studio has done it. We all make an appearance.
Yeah. That's awesome.
Trenton ReynoldsIs there anything you can put into words of what you feel like you've learned from this past year? year or so the COVID time?
Todd SquiresFrom the COVID time? Yeah. The main thing that I learned is that it's important to stick to some kind of routine of some sort that somehow keeps your mind... occupied or busy or something. I think that there were a lot of people, including a good friend of mine recently who just had like a little nervous breakdown. And it took this long for it to happen. But I think it's because So many people were told to stay inside, non-essential businesses stay home, freeways are empty, everyone's at home, and they're gonna drink, they're gonna do something that somehow, they're gonna spark up some new sort of addiction, whether even if it's gambling or, 'cause you can do that all online now too. And I saw a lot of that and it's completely understandable and I sympathize with all of that and I know that that could have very easily happened to me, especially if I had stayed home at the house with my wife in the same house, we would have eventually, you know, driven each other crazy, I'm sure. And so for me, it was important to get up every day to do my exercises in the morning so you get that sort of oxygen flowing to meditate in the morning and just you know sort of release all the tension I might have and then just come in here and And I don't mean to say that it's important to have this routine and completely keep doing the same thing over and over and over Again because I to a certain extent I do love a little change, too So I was embracing the change that this was creating but so then as you were asking about earlier when you first came here and I didn't have any business. And so this was just this empty shop that wasn't running anymore. And I had you guys next door, I could come by and just like, humans, hello. And I turned into a photo studio and just started to like force myself to like, I got like a million miniatures, like little people and things and created little scenes like beaches and, you know, people diving into coffee cups and just whatever it is that would sort of, you know, represent things that I love and taking pictures of David Lloyd's art. And I got some great shots of Yumi over here and she was letting me, you know, sort of practice some of my ideas and And then I bought this like Ukrainian gas mask. Did you ever see me with that thing on? It's in my car. And I just started like taking self-portraits of myself and doing all these different things and then sending them to Shutterstock and then sort of selling some of my work on Shutterstock because they needed lots of stock photos. And I thought, well, a Ukrainian gas mask would definitely help and sold a bunch of pieces that way.
Yeah.
Todd SquiresYeah. That's funny. So that's what I think is that, but to answer your question, sorry I'm so roundabout about it, but I think that it's, you gotta keep moving. Even if resting is a form of moving, you have to do something new and different every single day or else... And that's what I learned, was that a lot of people fell into some sort of very depressing routine and I'm glad that I didn't, but I tried to help as many people as I could along the way.
Trenton ReynoldsIt strikes me that if you don't have an intentional pattern that's generative, you will fall into patterns that are... destructive, right? Like it's inevitable. And I certainly saw some of that happen on both sides, you know, good patterns and bad patterns that I found myself. For yourself? Yeah, for myself, for sure. You know, we talked in the beginning of finding your own voice, Have you found it? Do you feel like you are still searching for the completion of that voice? Or are you, have you found it?
Todd SquiresAs far as finding my voice goes, I think that I find a fraction of my voice in every one of these endeavors that I do, but I never want to completely and totally find my voice because then I'll feel like there's no other voice to be found, you know? Like I wanna keep it open to like, there's another voice I can find, but here's one aspect of my voice, and I've found several aspects of my voice over the years for sure.
Trenton Reynolds- It's not a fair question to ask, but how would you characterize that?
What is your voice?
Todd SquiresI think that a lot of it lies in good intention. A lot of it lies in open to any kind of spiritual experience, even though I'm a huge believer in science. And I think that a lot of it lies in bettering humanity in some way, like contributing somehow to making someone's, whether it be day, life, their year better, because when you're able to do that, I mean, I don't mean to make this sound selfish or anything, but it feels really good to help someone else that actually appreciates the help that you're giving them. 'Cause there are plenty of times, like that homeless woman that goes by that, I don't know if you've ever seen her, but she's been living somewhere around here for years. And the only thing that you can really give her is just maybe an acknowledgement that she exists, but never try to give her something because she, you know what I mean? So there are different people and you have to kind of realize that too. So sometimes just acknowledging someone's existence is the best way worlds to them.
Right.
Trenton ReynoldsYeah, I think there's something very powerful about that.
Todd SquiresYeah, and if someone can, you know, and if a sandwich will help someone or like a donation to something can help someone and you're able to do it, then great. It's your duty to do it.
Trenton ReynoldsWell, Todd, thank you so much for your time. It was a great conversation. And, you know, something that I could talk a lot longer about would be just... I'd be curious to hear your thoughts about, I don't know, some of the things that you were talking about, memory, about, you know, people seeing these combinations of one-second moments and having one thing somehow jump out as representative or somehow embodying this larger feeling or this larger kind of... theme, you know, and then also this idea of taking bits and pieces and shoving them all together and kind of how that reflects the nature of memory and recall and how all these things start to mix. Anyway, I find all that very fascinating.
Todd SquiresAnd as you well know, you have to do it. First you've got to just shove everything together and say, well, that doesn't work. And then you have to say... okay, so let's reconstruct it until we reconstruct it and curate it until it works. Right. Yeah.
Trenton ReynoldsThere's an interesting thing that, you know, if you've ever talked to somebody who's getting into art or, you know, they're just learning art, or, you know, anybody really, like they'll do a drawing and it's one of their first drawings and it's like, It's so precious. You know, it's like you could not tell them You know to set that aside and do another one. It's like no, I'm I'm I've got gold here, right? Like this It's like I don't think people really it's it's counterintuitive To think that The good stuff happens when you shove everything together. Like when you let go of that. You can't predict it. You can't force it. It's like people want to force that golden moment.
Todd SquiresI don't know what I'm trying to say, but it's like... You know it's real because there's an energy behind it. And when you feel that energy, you create something and you're just like, "Okay, that's not so great, but it felt so good to make that. I'm going to go do another one, and I'm going to do another one." And that's what you hope that you want to ride that. And it's rare, but it's great when it happens.
Trenton ReynoldsYeah, when it happens, that feeling is the best.
Todd SquiresAnd I see you when you get those moments too. Like maybe my reactions... aren't as great as you'd want them to be or whatever, just because I tend to be very sort of you know, calm and measured about things even though I'm sort of excited on the inside, but you know, I like it when you just say, "Hey, Todd, I got what I'm doing now." You know, and I'm just like, "Oh my god, keep doing that." You know, because, and it's not so much that like whether it looks awesome to me or it doesn't look awesome to me, I like the way you're telling me. So that's why I'm hoping that you just keep doing it.
Trenton ReynoldsI've had that same experience where you're talking to somebody and they're like, they're kind of going through the motions of communicating whatever about themselves, but then they hit on something that they're like, you can tell there's an energy there. It's something that goes straight down to their foundation, right? And it's wonderful to see. I get that. Thank you, Todd, for making time to talk with me. It is inspiring and motivating to be surrounded by really great artists. I feel honored to be able to have these conversations. And thanks for listening to Dabble On. I'm glad you're there. I will have another conversation for you, so come back. Also rate this podcast on iTunes, make a donation on the website. and tell friends and family. And go make some art, y'all.